Just had a new pump installed by an installer. New pipes had to be fitted. The top of the pump has air in it. The water held overnight but there are now tiny bubbles in the chlorinator. Our previous pump did not do this. There are no significant bubbles coming out of jets after being on for a few minutes. However, the must be an air leak - mustn’t there? should I get the installer back?
Hello Edward - We’d be glad to help you. You’ll usually see air returning to the pool if there is an air leak. There are other factors that could cause small air bubbles to develop in the pump basket. Low speed on a 2-speed or variable speed pump have been known to create small bubbles. Slight cavitation can cause air bubbles. Cavitation can be caused by having too small of a diameter of suction side pipe, too long of a distance of suction pipe or too many suction side fittings.
Did you change the HP of the pump? What is the make and model of the pump? What size plumbing do you have on the suction side (1.5",2", etc.)?
Thank you very much for your assistance. It is a relatively small pool, approx 8000 gallons. The new pump is red leopard 1hp, dropped from 1.5hp. 2 inch pipe from skimmer to pump but a connector required to take it to 1.5 as pump had 1.5 fitting on in and out. 1.5 from pump through filter back to pool.
The pump lid is convex and so air sitting in top of lid. I attach a photo. not sure if you can see but there are 8 segments to lid, 3 have larger air bubbles and a 4th has a smaller one and the centre circle has a round bubble.
Those bubbles don’t appear to be the kind you see with an air leak. You usually see more bubbles and they would be churning or swirling. However, you can check to see if you have a suction side air leak. You can use your garden hose to source the pool air leak. While your pump is circulating, run a steady stream of water over the suspected area and its seams; if the area is pulling air when water is applied to the leak it will block air from entering the system. When the leak is blocked by the water the pump should prime in a few seconds as long as there are no further leaks.
As far as the chlorinator, it is common to see those small bubbles.
Ok. Thanks a lot. I have tried the shaving cream didn’t find anything - only problem pump in a very difficult position in the corner of shed and so hard to see everywhere. Can’t really do water test unfortunately. I looked very closely inside and a very few small bubbles can be seen coming up in pump but very, very few and no churning. Also, one other thing noted is small whirlpools on top of water - never had those before. Does that tell you anything?
Thanks very much for your advice. If it is not an air leak - why is the air there? Is it important or should I just forget about it? The reason I was concerned was the installer was very slap dash and I did not have air visible in last pump. My last pump did not have a convex lid though.
Ps photo of pump lid is with pump off, the 4 bubbles sort of just swirl round a little while running but not churning.
There are some instances where you can have a couple air bubbles in the lid but not have an air leak. I named a couple in my first response. I asked around the office to see if anyone else had ideas. One thought was that if the impeller veins were clogged it would not be able to pull those trapped air bubbles through the system. Also, you went down in HP. I’m not familiar with Red Leopard pumps but maybe that pump is not strong enough to clear those air bubbles.
It may be worth contacting the installer and see if they can come back out to inspect the system.
Edward,
My thought is the pump it’s just a tiny bit undersized to fully fill the strainer pot with water. I have run into this issue on a few different pools. I don’t think it’s a major issue but the only way to resolve would be to go up to a larger HP. Another thought would be to look at your plumbing… can you take a few photos showing the plumbing going in and out of the pump as well as a wide shot showing all of your plumbing? Sometimes if you have a lot of 90s there are options for getting rid of those resulting in better water flow.
Thank You
Patrick
Firstly, I would like to thank you for the fantastic replies and service. I am blown away.
With regard to the plumbing the 2" pipe comes out of the ground does 1 90 degree bend and then straight to the pump . The previous pump inlet was about 1" lower and so I expected the installer to have to do an annoying 2*45degree connection to ensure the pipe remained horizontal but he just shoved the pipe in and it now runs a tiny bit uphill into the 1.5" connector and into the pump. As I said the installer was not very impressive, he cut the pipes roughly, he didn’t clean up the pipe burrs and was very rough and also had very little knowledge about the whole system (hence my reticence to recontact him and why I am trying to learn and sort this out myself - with your assistance). After the pump in the 1.5" pipe there are 2 90 dergee bends which drop the outlet down to floor level where it enters the upright filter. It then exits the filter and into the chlorinator.
Pictures following.
In terms of performance, pool is looking good. In terms of air - initially we had 4 “segments” of air (as you can see the pump is divided into 8 segments and the circular segment), after a few days it dropped to 2.5 segments and today is probably back up to about 4.5 segments of air. PSI =7.5.
I can see what you are saying re pump not clearing the air as it doesn’t clear while pumping - I thought maybe it was just the tiniest of air leaks? But maybe not? I did have one thought, I have not tested with vacuuming the pool - I would assume this would apply additional pressure to the system and could possibly inform me if there is an air leak or some issue. I will try and do this tomorrow.
Hi Edward,
Thank you for the nice post! I do think if you could eliminate any of the 90’s on the discharge side of the pump or the discharge side of the filter then you would get better flow resulting in the elimination of the bubbles. Each 90 will decrease the flow of your pump, even if you can go with two 45’s in place of one 90 then this will help your flow. Rob and I put together a Video on How to Fix Pool Pump Priming Issues which discusses this exact topic, I think you will find it helpful. We also have an article on Total Dynamic Head (TDH) which goes into even greater detail about this topic, the second chart in this article showing the TDH for each fitting is quite helpful.
Thank You
Patrick
Dear Patrick,
Again thank you for your reply. I have learnt a great deal from INYO.
Would you mind confirming for me that I understand correctly… Technically my pump is not priming! It is priming to 98% but it should prime to 100%. This is probably due to the length/configuration of my pipes after the pump to the pool. I probably didn’t have this problem before because I had 1.5hp but even though technically the 1hp is good for the pool size it is not perfect given the pipe configuration?
Given this being the problem - can I ask you - do you think it is a big problem? Obviously not ideal, but any reason it won’t work fine for many years ahead? What actual issues are likely to occur? Will put fixing the pipes on the joblist but just wondering if it needs to be high priority. Pool is looking fine and I check the air daily and it basically varies between 2 “segments” of air to 4 “segments” of air.
Thanks again for all your time and advice.
Hi Edward,
Your last post couldn’t have said it better than I could have. I have posted your questions below with my reply in Bold
- “My pump is priming to 98% but it should prime to 100%. This is probably due to the length/configuration of my pipes after the pump to the pool. I probably didn’t have this problem before because I had 1.5hp but even though technically the 1hp is good for the pool size it is not perfect given the pipe configuration?” Spot on, you said it exactly!
- Given this being the problem - can I ask you - do you think it is a big problem? Nonot a big problem
- Obviously not ideal, but any reason it won’t work fine for many years ahead? I would eventually try to remove some of the 90’s from the plumbing as it could make your pump work harder causing it to fail prematurely, but nothing that has to be done ASAP
- What actual issues are likely to occur? it could make your pump work harder causing it to fail prematurely, you may be under-powered to run your pool vacuum.
- Will put fixing the pipes on the joblist but just wondering if it needs to be high priority? It does not need to be a top priority, I would try to get this done in the next 6-12 months
Thanks for the kind words and participating in our forum. If you ever need any help with your pool please let us know or if you think you can give help to other users on the forum then feel free to jump in and give a hand.
Thanks again
Patrick
www.inyopools.com
Thanks again. Absolutely exceptional service, knowledge and information.